I paid $750 for a 2br 30 years ago. I pay $850 for a 3br now. I used to live outside San Francisco, now I’m in Ohio.
Not living in Ohio is worth at least $1k a month, so that tracks.
Yeah places with really low rents, there’s always a reason. But sometimes it’s still an option.
I used to pay $1100 for a 3 bedroom apartment 10 years ago, now a 2 bedroom is $2600+
Having taken the point of this post as it was intended, we can also recognize that learning how to manage your money is in fact always a good thing. Will basic hygiene undo generations of economics? No, but we certainly shouldn’t NOT teach young people to manage their money.
Nobody on earth has suggested we stop teaching economic literacy. We should however stop pretending it is sufficient. We require systemic change.
I think there’s a suggestion we start teaching it. I’m 37, but there were idiots who didn’t understand credit cards when I was 18, and there’s just as many now, and there were just as many in 1995. I think this response thread here was meant to say yes, understanding the system is fucked, even if we come out on the other side with a functional economy, people still need to learn some personal responsibility when it comes to spending.
There’s a famous Agatha Christie quote where she mentions that when she was young, she never imagined she’d be rich enough to own an automobile or poor enough to not have servants in her house. At some point, the affordability of one shot way past the other.
In my lifetime, I’ve seen huge cost increases in housing, and huge cost decreases in most technological products. When I was a kid, the normal TV size was something like 20 inches, and cost more than a month’s rent for a typical apartment. In 1990, the average rent was $447, according to this. I found a Sears catalog from 1989 with a 25 inch TV selling for $549, and a 20 inch TV for $318. It would be hard to convince someone from 1990 that one day the cheapest, shittiest apartments in the poorest neighborhoods would rent for more than a 60-inch TV per month. Or that the typical ambulance ride costs something like a month’s salary of a factory worker.
That’s the real problem with old people’s sense of money. The human tendency is to assume that all products cost the same multiple of those products prices in their early adulthood, so the luxury products of their youth remain the luxury products of today. These old people are stuck in some kind of Agatha Christie style of cost comparison, without the self awareness, and thinking that someone who owns a cell phone should be able to afford to buy a single family detached house, or couldn’t possibly be bankrupted by a single Emergency Room visit.
Please stop blaming “old people”. It’s a divide and conquer tactic. I have grown children that are struggling with housing costs, and I absolutely understand why. Because greedy wealthy people/corporations are buying up all the property. If “old people” are pulling the avocado toast argument—they’re probably wealthy. Young wealthy people use the same argument. Something to think about regarding TVs. They were expensive back in the day, but they lasted 30+ years. ✌️ ☮️
Please stop blaming “old people”.
I’m not “blaming” anyone. I’m pointing out the mechanism that causes a portion of old people to be out of touch on these things. They rely on their own experiences to draw inferences that don’t actually apply to others.
"That’s the real problem with old people’s sense of money”. That is blaming old people.
“Blame” means to attribute for some negative result. There’s no assigning fault here, just an observation, and an explanation behind that observation.
If I said “Bob is a fucking idiot,” that’s not blaming Bob for anything.
So yeah, I stand by my explanation behind the observation in OP’s screenshot: that people tend to draw on past experiences even when those experiences are no longer as relevant, or are even actively misleading. And that the phenomenon I describe (that not all prices inflate at the same rate or preserve the same ratios to each other) exacerbates the problem.
OK. I’m seeing “the real problem with old people”. So, de facto, there’s a problem with old people.
It is absolutely OK to assign accurate blame and this basic misunderstanding absolutely afflicts people who aren’t rich. The kind of person who bought their house when it’s cheap and thinks the $2000 they pay in property taxes per year are murderous whilst ignoring the fact that folks around them are paying $2000 a month in rent.
I don’t know where you live, but property taxes are sky rocketing as well. And, thanks to global warming, house insurance is also sky rocketing. A lot of people who own their home are facing difficulties. There are communities in British Columbia where insurance companies refuse to offer fire coverage. There are communities in British Columbia where insurance companies refuse to offer flood insurance. These same insurance companies used to. You know why they won’t now?? Because the Oligarchs own the insurance companies, and they know what’s coming.
I totally agree with you that this is true, but I think it’s more a problem with reactionary thinking than anything else. The way I see it, the type of thinking that leads to reactionary comments is individualistic solutions to social and economic problems because you’re not allowed to question affordability.
People of all ages pull this shit. I can’t count how many times some millennial on reddit made unwanted suggestions for a poor person’s budgeting or grocery purchases. It is obviously difficult for older folks to understand things they’re not experiencing, but I don’t think that’s the primary issue.
Ask any traitor lunatic under 40 what to do about high prices, they’ll tell you exactly.
I definitely see this a lot. Any time someone complains about the unaffordability of life you get a swarm of people prying into their personal details desperately trying to figure out how that person’s situation is their own fault.
Exactly. I never want to hear from someone making >$300,000 that I should be eating lentils all week.
We had to give up entirely on affording a house. There are ROOMS for rent at $1200 here. This used to be a low COL area until COVID. We had low infection rates so a ton of people moved here and we don’t have the infrastructure to support them. We’ve been priced out of what living space we did have and since there’s still the illusion it’s cheap to live here, it’s almost impossible to get a living wage.
My mortgage is close to 1600 a month. Plus HOA fees on top of that.
I dont think rent being at that price range is always greedy landlords.
I think you’re right. The problem is that salaries are not keeping up. It’s been a chronic problem.
Look at what it would cost to rent a similar house in your area in terms of sq footage and location. Note a house not an apartment I shouldn’t be surprised if its closer to $3500
I have the same mortgage and a property manager I talked to said my house would rent for $2300. Major American city.
All CEOs are bastards or something
“Have you tried simply having more money?”
Life’s really easy when you’re born rich and white.
If you’re born rich it doesn’t matter what color you are. The difference is probably being born middle class and white, that’s probably where you reap the most benefit from systemic racism. Being born poor, doesn’t matter, the cards are forever stacked against you.
I bought my house in 2014, $224k at 4% APR, my monthly payment including taxes is $1400/mo.
It’s only been 11 years, inflation is up ~35% in that time, so buying the same house now should be ~$1900/mo. Actual price if I were to buy it now? ~$3500/mo. And wages have barely budged. No wonder young people entering the workforce can’t buy houses anymore.
Interestingly, though, that huge run-up in price is also half the reason why people think they need to own homes. We need to stop looking to homes to be the “engine of wealth creation” or we’re only asking for more of this.
The other half of the equation, of course, is wanting to have a stable home that you can control. And that’s still as valid as ever.
But homeownership isn’t necessarily the best choice for everyone. It reduces your mobility and optionality and it carries some risks and hidden costs.
But as long as everyone looks at it as the gateway to wealth, and feels like everyone is getting a piece of that action except them, it will contribute to the continuation of hyperinflation.
This is exactly right. I don’t believe in property ownership anyway, but even if you do, it is still irrational to chase this from a social and economic planning model. Life should be affordable for everyone. Period.
We bought a house in Tampa Florida area in 2018, our monthly cost was $1400/month. Moved to Washington in 2022 and bought a house and the house is smaller and our monthly payment is $3k. Area matters of course, but comparably I’d imagine we’re in similar situations.
No one wants to work (for nothing) anymore!
Is this the original unmodified drawing? What a dump truck on the lad.
Nope!
Right I remembered him fit, not deformed lol.
This is from the alternate reality where Rob Liefeld illustrated Watchmen
Nah, Doc has feet, couldn’t be liefeld
Somebody actually took the time and effort to make that adjustment.
Dr. Manhatten got back.
Exactly. $400 for mine. $100 would fill a shopping cart with groceries back then. Health insurance: $80-125/mo. Internet: $15/mo. Garage sales almost everything was less than $10, most of it was less than $5. Goodwill was a deal. DIY/homemade was a deal, a way to save money.
It was a different time. There’s no equivalent to that time today, today is pretty awful.
And now it’s all going to be so much worse thanks to MAGA, oligarchs, and Heritage.
Yes, what is up with thrift stores charging almost the same as “first-hand” stores? Yet another example of how this generation is screwed (along with all of us old people).
Boutique thrift shops all try to act like they’re some amazing place to find funky retro fashion just waiting to be discovered on a Tiktok. It’s all overpriced. We’ve been to Goodwill and Habitat locally for stuff. Prices go from great to dirt cheap. They just want to move stuff, not hold on to someone’s idea of vintage cool.
Or they somehow want to price things off eBay prices. Bro, you are a thrift store. You aren’t some place that should be trying to get the absolute most out of an item.
Price it vaguely on what people might pay for some used, unwashed, beat to hell thing. If someone thinks they can get more by selling it online, that’s fine. That’s on them. You don’t have to compete with them. Turnover of items is more important than the most money on that old glass cup.
You used to be able to get grandpa’s old used golf clubs for $5/7 at goodwill and I put together a whole set for cheap. Moved and had to leave it behind now they put all the clubs straight online, you can’t even get them at the stores anymore. And the price is barely better than a newvset from Walmart. I wanna golf again :(
Video games are almost always ridiculous too. They’ll sell anything good online, and then charge like $10 for one of their 40 copies of Wii Fit.
The only good place to thrift nowadays is the small local places run by like churches. Goodwill sells shitty acrylic yarn for more than it costs new, wants $20+ for used kitchen appliances, sells current dollar tree shit for $5…
Goodwill fell off. It’s worth noting how the stuff we buy is basically worthless for resale the moment we buy it, since cheap new stuff is outcompeting it. It’s only value is use value.
Good news! Tariffs just made new stuff significantly more expensive so the resale value will be higher now. /s
Watching new vs used prices on things will be intresting
They do employ people who might not be able to get a job elsewhere, so not evil, just halfway shitty.
What the fuck? Thanks for making my day even worse I guess. Seriously thank you for the information, they will no longer get my business.
I know it’s a little off topic but eBay is a fucking scam as well… So many used items go for prices very close to brand new. I live in California, which charges VAT for ebay transactions. Add in shipping and I would be paying more than brand new for the vast majority of the inventory.
There are no good deals on ebay unless you spend a lot of time in bidding wars. You still risk getting a damaged item too…
Hey, at least they employ people who might not be able to get a job elsewhere. Goodwill does anyway.
Ive noticed this at chains, but not at my local stores. Goodwill for example, I always see dollar tree items marked as $2+. I know Theyre from dollar tree because theyre still in the damn package.
I found a neat looking board game at the thrift store once. I looked it up on my phone to check reviews, and learned it would be cheaper to buy it new than what they were asking. Usually they have good deals but not that time.
Walmart cut costs to the bone and squeezed down on what thrift stores used to charge.
Thrift stores are a deal compared to Macy’s, JC Penny, and such.
I blame macklemore.
Now playing MACKLEMORE & RYAN LEWIS - Thrift Shop
Pooooor Heritage Foo dation
Actually think their kids will be down to be obscenely rich in the future world where coral reef diving and backcountry skiing are only possible in VR
(I have to assume wealth and intelligence have a decent correlation sometimes, but Heritage proves the relationship is certainly not 1:1)
(I have to assume wealth and intelligence have a decent correlation sometimes, but Heritage proves the relationship is certainly not 1:1)
They decidedly do not have a correlation. The majority of wealthy people inherited their wealth. Inheriting enough wealth to pay a competent finance professional has been the primary means of accruing wealth since at least the 80s. Those getting wealthy from startups and the like are outliers.
Agreed.
The only way for a wage earner to bootstrap their way up is to have money when historic opportunities to invest present themselves, like March 2020 and April 2025. If you have a few thousand to invest now, chances are that will turn into a massive profit over time. And even better, hold those securities for longer than a year and you get a preferred, lower tax rate on any profits.
But most people can’t do that. They’re stuck taking out an (air quotes) “interest-free” loan from Klarna to make sure they don’t starve this week. Our politicians are, thankfully, focused on the most important priorities, like drag queen story time. (And that’s sarcasm, btw.)
Please don’t invest right now. You are right that you can make a lot of money if you know what you’re doing, but it’s still a casino. With the people running the US right now, if they ever fully implement the tariffs, the market is going to eat shit. Then you can buy if there’s some glimmer of hope like Republicans losing Congress in 2026. I’m not trying to do US defaultism here, I believe this advice holds worldwide.
I pulled all my money out when Trump got elected, and that was a good choice. If I’d gone all in on options I’d be straight up hood rich, but I can’t gamble everything we have.
If the US collapses, the dollars you saved from pulling your investments is worthless…
That’s true, but so would the investments themselves.
Yes… But if the US doesn’t collapse then you make a lot of money buying the dip.
So either the US survives, and you make a lot of money if you invested, or the US crumbles and your cash or investments are both worth the same amount (zero).
I switched my retirement accounts to cash apprx feb 28, before the tariffs announcement and the market starting crashing. I just moved back into stocks this week. I’m convinced we’ve seen the worst of the tariffs… too many people are in trumps ear telling him he’s a retard. It’s only up from here.
Cluster B personality disorders don’t change their mind when called out, they double down. And interruption of the self constructed false reality makes them reactive.
I hope you’re correct for your benefit and the benefit of people who have retirement funds in the market.
I disagree however. Even if that fucking toddler-brained jackass backs completely off the tariffs (which I don’t think his ego will let him) he will do more heinous shit that will ruin the world economy in other ways. He’s also got several accelerationists in his ear that would love to see another great depression.
In less than 90 days the tariffs are back on, and the insane China ones are currently rolling I believe. Adidas put out a statement today saying the shoes are going to get a lot more expensive. Also, as of today, the oligarch Jeff Bezos is under federal investigation over a rumor that Amazon was going to tell customers what portion of the price of an item was due to tariffs. Just over a rumor. A rumor about a legal action that would be a smart business decision.
I’m keeping my money in the bank, and some in cash hidden in my home. Hopefully FDIC insurance still works.
Strongly agree. We’ve seen nothing yet and I think we’re going to see quarter after quarter of poor earnings and layoffs. Some empty shelves mid to late May. Housing crash at the end of this year or beginning of 2026. Hate to be somewhat doom and gloom but I’m also not going to miss this opportunity to jump back in with liquid. Good luck!
Yeah. We’ll see i suppose. The markets holding back a lot of suppressed upward mobility that we saw when the fake “tariffs are off” tweet happened. One whiff of good news will have us going up again.
In any case, at least I mitigated some of the damage. Can’t win 100% every time.
Just keep in mind the maxim- The market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent. It’s more of a vibes casino than it ever was before the GME stuff.
Even though I think you could be right, please don’t bet the barn. I don’t want to see you get hurt.
Ill be ok. Been 100% in a vtsax equivalent for 10 years… not retiring any time soon
I started at $1,400 in 2011. That went up to $3,200 by 2023 for the cheapest place in a worse part of town.
I had to move to an entirely different city. Fuck San Diego. Shitty ass city.
My last apartment was 1500 a month and I made a huge jump to buy a house with a 2500 a month mortgage. Seems crazy at first, but in 5 years that same shitty “luxury” apartment is going to cost at least 2800 a month.
“Greedy landlords” is an easy cope out. Instead we should realize the system that’s built to continously inflate the economy whereas our wages stagnate at best.
