I strongly disagree with the sentiments of these tweets but why would they be considered hate speech? What an I missing?
Musk over here trying to conflate gender-affirming hormone medication being taken by 16-17 year olds with the mutilation of children’s genitalia.
This is thinly veiled hate speech. They are straw-manning those they see as “other”, for the purpose of placing themselves in a morally superior position. It is arguably defensible lies (I didn’t mean, I just meant…), functioning as a dogwhistle to manufacture outrage over imagined extremes that aren’t actually happening, all to stir hatred in the public against LGBTQ+ people and ideologies. And they cap it off with a call to action.
This is painfully similar to how hate speech against the Jewish people started.
I know this will be an unpopular opinion in this thread but this isn’t hate speech in Canada. It’s a vile perspective shared by someone with many impressionable followers but it’s not hate speech. Labeling this exchange as hate speech weakens this term and is not useful in shifting discourse or people’s opinions.
When you use the phrase, “hate speech in Canada,” it is clear you are using the specific legal standard for criminal speech in Canada. That is not the only definition of hate speech. More generally, anything intended to express or incite hatred is hate speech, it need not be legally found to be a crime.
Nearly any discourse can be considered hate speech using your broad definition. And when everything is hate speech nothing is hate speech, it loses it’s usefulness as a term. Let’s use accurate language
Let’s deal with that problem if it comes up. And it never fucking has. But meanwhile we have had the converse problem an AWFUL lot of times.
If you cannot recognize and boldly denounce hate, that’s a you problem, and you need to deal with it. If you cannot recognize these specific tweets as expression of hate, then just fuck off and leave the rest of us alone.
Like seriously, you’re more concerned with some abstract “purity of the language” issue than opposing actual hate that is actually hurting people you probably know by simplycalling it hate.
Don’t straw man and then get aggressive about opinions I obviously don’t hold. Feel free to ask questions if something is unclear. These kinds of disingenuous discources are part of the problem.
Straw man, my ass. You refuse to call hate hate.
Oh boy, this isn’t going to be a popular opinion. I’m a former therapist and I still work in healthcare. Part of why I left therapy is because I disagree with the prevalence of gender affirming care.
You’re allowed to disagree with me. I know it’s a contentious issue. But my experience is that our culture and institutions are using one label and one treatment as a panacea for a variety of issues where they are not appropriate. People with a variety of underlying mental health problems are being convinced into believing they have gender dysphoria, and they are funneled into that diagnosis and a type of treatment that is not as reversible as we pretend. Hormone therapy can be extremely detrimental to a developing body and mind, there are lots of studies out there to show this.
I think the core concepts behind the Trans acceptance movement are positive. I think people who can only find relief for their dysphoria through transitioning should be allowed to, and should be accepted and respected just as any other individual should be. As much as people hate Jordan Peterson, he has said these exact same things. I don’t see hatred in this stance. I see caution.
The anger you mistake for hatred is due to the concern of over-use of gender affirming care, not the existence of it. It absolutely should exist for those who don’t respond to other treatment methods. But I’ve seen a lot of patients come in assuming they are trans, desiring gender affirming care, when the reality is that you don’t have to be trans to hate yourself, hate your body, or feel an affinity for archetypes of the opposite gender. A lot of these people come in believing that transitioning will cure them of their disordered thoughts, but it is not a cure-all for all identity disorders or associated depression. Even if you do specifically have gender dysphoria, jumping to gender affirming care is radical. It’s not how we treat any other kind of disordered thinking, and largely stems from political interference into medicine rather than from science, in my opinion. There is no medical reason not to try more traditional forms of therapy and medications before pursuing the less understood and riskier treatments. We fast track this type of treatment now for ideological reasons regarding the sanctity of trans identity, not because it makes sense from the benefit/harm analysis used in every other aspect of medicine.
I very much wish the LGBT community could try to understand where moderates like myself are coming from. I have never treated a trans person with less respect than I would treat anyone else. I believe some people absolutely do not have any other viable options, and that transitioning can provide much needed relief for some. But I believe politics has overstepped into the realm of medicine in this case. At the very least, my hope is to protect children and teenagers from undergoing gender affirming care until it is absolutely clear and necessary that it is the only path of treatment. Not because trans people are evil, but because these treatments can do more harm than good if they aren’t absolutely necessary.
Even if you do specifically have gender dysphoria, jumping to gender affirming care is radical. It’s not how we treat any other kind of disordered thinking
Gender Dysphoria is not disordered thinking. That’s exactly why the name was changed in DSM-5 (formerly Gender Identity Disorder in DSM-IV). Or if you prefer, it’s exactly why ICD-11 renamed it to Gender Incongruence and moved it out of the “Mental, Behavioural, and Neurodevelopmental Disorders” section. Shouldn’t a former therapist commenting on the issue know that?
Does Gender Dysphoria present alongside disordered thinking? Quite often! But that doesn’t invalidate one’s gender identity. Transition didn’t make my F33.2 Major Depressive Disorder, Recurrent Severe magically go away, but it sure is easier to cope with and treat these days. (Well, I guess it’s 6A71.3 now that ICD-11 is out.)
I think people who can only find relief for their dysphoria by transitioning should be allowed to
And there we have it: the core of the argument you’re making is that people should only be allowed to transition if a gatekeeper is satisfied it’s the only way they can get relief. And the only way to “show” that is to suffer more and more — unnecessarily! — until someone like you finally believes them, which might never happen. Do you believe trans people genuinely have the gender we say we do? If so, withholding treatment is simply cruel. Or do you not believe us and just think it’s okay for us to “pretend” if nothing else works? That’s not real acceptance.
There is no medical reason not to try more traditional forms of therapy and medications before pursuing the less understood and riskier treatments.
Scientists still don’t fully understand how antidepressant medications work. They come with a black-boxed warning (the strongest kind) in the US, and similarly strong warnings in the Canadian product monographs. Benzodiazepines commonly used for anxiety disorders can be extremely risky. Puberty blockers and hormone treatments are better understood and carry less risk in many cases.
I very much wish the LGBT community could try to understand where moderates like myself are coming from.
Oh, believe me, we understand exactly where you’re coming from… quite possibly better than you do. You’re only fooling yourself with that “moderate” label.
And that’s why I wrote this reply out for the bystanders — it’s not actually for you.
oh if you really want to jump down the rabbit hole, just read “your consent is not required”. everything you say, or even don’t say is considered “disordered thinking” if a psychiatrist decided it is. they are literally the chiropractors of the MD world, everything is based on opinion and drug company statements with SFA to back it up.
